Wednesday, June 27, 2007

trust - estate - UGMA/UTMA - funerals - Nolo - heirloom - schmuck - ashes

[11:29:35 AM] pD says: am doing trust/will for my kid

[11:29:42 AM] pD says: it is painful and tedious like doing taxes

[11:30:10 AM] pD says: but, i also find it almost "therapeutic" in forcing a deeper look into life.

[11:30:29 AM] pD says: not sure i would recommend the exercise for that reason, but, it is a bonus

[11:31:16 AM] pD says: things like how to maintain life support and such. really gets you (me) thinking...

[11:32:29 AM] AE says: I've done it three times now

[11:32:45 AM] AE says: one for each child, and a joint trust for our estate.

[11:32:47 AM] pD says: trust/will?

[11:32:58 AM] AE says: three trusts, one will.

[11:33:11 AM] pD says: oh, why do you need separate ones for each kid? wouldn't one be enough?

[11:33:21 AM] AE says: they each have a separate tax ID.

[11:33:35 AM] AE says: so the income counts against their tax, not ours.

[11:33:50 AM] AE says: if we lumped them together, the tax would be much higher.

[11:34:04 AM] pD says: so, you pre-parcel out to each kid? i think our setup is to centrally administer and they get equal pay-out

[11:34:18 AM] pD says: is that a bad idea? what else do i need to think about?

[11:34:24 AM] AE says: is this an inheritance trust?

[11:34:41 AM] AE says: are you creating the trust so when you die all your assets are held in trust?

[11:34:55 AM] AE says: if so, then that is different than what I’m talking about.

[11:35:21 AM] AE says: we have trusts for each child to receive when they are 21; to pay for college, house, business, whatever.

[11:35:30 AM] AE says: then we have a separate trust for our estate.

[11:35:34 AM] pD says: yes - assets are held in trust for the benefit of children and there is a pay out schedule

[11:35:51 AM] AE says: Right. to defer death tax

[11:36:00 AM] pD says: Are you referring to the UTM thingie for each kid?

[11:36:08 AM] AE says: what is that?

[11:37:07 AM] AE says: unified threat management? University of Tennessee at Martin?

[11:37:19 AM] AE says: Underwear Tying Monkeys?

[11:37:33 AM] AE says: Unique Tickle Machine?

[11:37:48 AM] AE says: Understanding Transverse Mechanics?

[11:38:05 AM] AE says: Utilizing Topographical Marsupials?

[11:38:07 AM] nsy says: under the mountain?

[11:41:36 AM] pD says: hmm...

[11:41:40 AM] pD says: for the life of me, i cannot find it

[11:41:55 AM] pD says: it is a simplified trust that is accepted all 50 states

[11:42:14 AM] pD says: it requires minimum paperwork but has a payout at 21.

[11:42:32 AM] pD says: usually set up by grandparents/parents to fund education

[11:45:07 AM] pD says: just out of curiosity, wouldn't the estate trust be able to handle the education, housing, etc. for all the kids? Is there a particular reason for doing 4?

[11:49:20 AM] AE says: well, one is a trust/will. a standard revocable trust.

[11:49:27 AM] AE says: that one is not paid out until we die.

[11:49:41 AM] AE says: the other two are held for our children until they turn 21.

[11:50:11 AM] AE says: we pay tax on the children's ones every year so when they receive them there is no massive loss to taxes.

[11:51:11 AM] AE says: and we're being sneaky about it.

[11:51:25 AM] AE says: not telling our children until they receive it.

[11:51:43 AM] AE says: that way, they still work hard to earn admission to college, scholar ships, etc.

[11:51:48 AM] pD says: you are very kind

[11:51:59 AM] AE says: It makes life hard when you know you don't really have to work for a living.

[11:52:06 AM] pD says: for us, we are hanging onto our money - so, kids need to be nice to us. :)!

[11:53:31 AM] AE says: so your trust is to hold your estate until you die, then pay it out to your beneficiaries?

[11:53:35 AM] pD says: but, seriously though, we plan to help our kid as much as possible. But, 21 does feel a bit young

[11:53:56 AM] pD says: of course, i did not feel that way when i was 21, but that is a separate story

[11:54:42 AM] AE says: i'm having my son manage his to some extent now.

[11:54:53 AM] AE says: that way, when the time comes, he will be used to doing it.

[11:54:55 AM] pD says: trust holds estate - we have full control over it - so we can give it out anyway we like. once we die, there is a pay-out schedule and conditions - so, kids still would not get a free ride

[11:55:05 AM] AE says: perfect.

[11:55:10 AM] pD says: i can be a bit of an asshole that way, i guess

[11:55:12 AM] AE says: that also minimizes the death tax.

[11:55:16 AM] AE says: no... it's smart.

[11:55:28 AM] AE says: also, prevents fights when you die.

[11:55:39 AM] AE says: as long as you and your wife are joint trustees.

[11:56:06 AM] pD says: actually, unless i die too soon, i plan to spent every cent that i've got. after all, i earned them

[11:58:00 AM] AE says: I figure the only way my kids are going to live better than me is if I help them.

[11:58:17 AM] AE says: that means making them better people, and then giving them financial advantage as well.

[11:59:32 AM] pD says: what constitutes a financial advanrage though?

[12:01:33 PM] AE says: you're typing with an accent.

[12:02:00 PM] pD says: cramped keyword or fat fingers, really

[12:02:13 PM] AE says: ah... yeah, that keyboard of yours is really small.

[12:12:16 PM] AE says: financial advantage = any extra money to get them started.

[12:12:37 PM] AE says: enough to pay for college or purchase a house or business.

[12:53:01 PM] pD says: wow! those are real money - a house in the silicon valley can be quite expensive - even if the house does not feel that way...

[1:11:26 PM] pD says: found it! Uniform Gifts to Minors/Uniform Transfers to Minors Accounts (UGMA/UTMA)

[1:11:33 PM] pD says: http://personal.fidelity.com/global/search/inquira/resultsindex.shtml?question=Uniform%20Gifts%20to%20Minors

[1:18:10 PM] nsy says: since i'm over 18, my mom just added me to her accounts so there is no estate tax taken out when she leaves. the only hassle is that I have to sign the papers any time she makes changes to her accounts. its a small price to pay.

[1:21:22 PM] nsy says: my father did not leave a will or anything and it was a total mess. in the end, the estate tax and lawyer fees were unreal, not to mention the time it takes to get everything sorted out, and the stress of arguing about what is best. i'm glad people are becoming more aware of these things and getting trusts.

[1:21:32 PM] nsy says: your children thank you!

[1:32:07 PM] pD says: yeah, that is part of what we want to avoid - all the family in-fighting. not that we are worth that much, but it is better that way

[1:32:49 PM] pD says: also, as part of the practice, it was good to talk about some of the issues that do not often enter typical conversation such as funeral arrangements

[1:33:42 PM] nsy says: yes, that was a big argument - one sister wanted a military funeral, one didn't, etc. gets very emotional.

[1:34:17 PM] nsy says: people want to cling to the material items they did not previously care about, too, so divvy up your stuff!

[1:34:29 PM] nsy says: no matter how small

[1:35:10 PM] pD says: but, that is also kind of tedious - who gets which picture, for example

[1:35:33 PM] pD says: actually, if you do not mind talking about it, how was it addressed eventually? in terms of divvy up things?

[1:43:54 PM] nsy says: no peaceful solution was found, so most of the stuff was donated or sold, and the heirlooms went to aunts and uncles. hopefully they will have wills.

[1:44:40 PM] pD says: sorry to hear that, that must have been a very difficult process

[1:45:03 PM] pD says: having gone through it though, what would you recommend? itemizing every physical possession seem a bit unrealistic

[1:47:39 PM] nsy says: yes, that is difficult. no perfect solution. but I guess I would ask the people I love if there is anything they specifically want if I die, then write that into the will. appointing an executor who is willing to be the "bad guy" would be a good solution - someone who you trust to be impartial and fair.

[1:49:38 PM] nsy says: otherwise, specify certain groups of items, and specify a "taking turns" choosing approach. So, if you have a collection, you can say person 1,2,3 choose an item, and repeat the cycle. for clothes, music, etc.

[1:50:29 PM] nsy says: i also sometimes think it would be nice to say - "if you gave it to me - you get dibs" or sumthin' simla

[2:50:01 PM] pD says: actually, i think this creates a very interesting auction situation that a proper "game" setup makes all the difference

[3:15:39 PM] nsy says: after my experience, i thought about starting a non-profit to help people deal with these things. i found that it is very helpful in taking stock of your life when you "get your house in order" preparing for death. maybe the egyptians had some good ideas there

[3:17:22 PM] pD says: Nolo is great with this. but, it takes initiative from the person: http://www.nolo.com/resource.cfm/catID/FD1795A9-8049-422C-9087838F86A2BC2B/309/

[3:20:41 PM] nsy says: good info on that site - thanks

[3:37:21 PM] pD says: we should design a set of game rules that would allow the heirs to pick "stuff" and still remain friendly afterward

[3:42:04 PM] AE says: the way my family did it after my grand ma died, and again after my mom died was this:

[3:42:25 PM] AE says: You first get to claim any item you gave to the deceased.

[3:43:20 PM] AE says: For the remaining stuff each person gets a roll of colored dots. Go around the house and place dots on anything you want.

[3:44:17 PM] AE says: If multiple people put dots on things, then bring them into a room with the people interested. they then trade things: "Ok, you can have the painting if I get the vase" kind of stuff.

[3:44:21 PM] AE says: it worked very well.

[3:45:41 PM] AE says: the only problem they has was my grandma's paintings: she had done quite a few, but the ones of the old place in Kansas was quite popular. They eventually decided it was best to share it: each person displays it for a year, then wraps it under the christmas tree and gives it to someone else.

[3:49:08 PM] pD says: that sounds like a very workable solution

[3:49:23 PM] pD says: a few questions though, this may or may not have been a problem for you guys.

[3:49:42 PM] pD says: how do you prove that you give something to the deceased

[3:50:41 PM] pD says: does each claimant have the same standing? so, that there is no preference for uncle and aunts, for example

[3:50:52 PM] pD says: finally, what happened to the stuff that nobody claimed?

[3:51:17 PM] AE says: the stuff no one claimed was donated to the salvation army.

[3:51:47 PM] AE says: as for the other one... why would you need to prove it? if you gave it to them you can claim it. if you didn't give it to them then you have no claim.

[3:52:03 PM] AE says: if you claim it but didn't really give it to them then you're a schmuck.

[3:52:24 PM] nsy says: if two people say they gave something to you, the executor hears them out and decides. or the dot thing, or names in a hat, or my personal favorite - everyone has to Reaux Sham Beaux

[3:52:30 PM] pD is a schmuck

[3:52:41 PM] pD says: but, that is how you (I) can game the system

[3:53:00 PM] AE says: someone has just died. if you're looking to game the system.. .then you really need to re-think your priorities...

[3:53:31 PM] pD the schmuck again

[3:54:10 PM] pD says: i agree with your emotional description, but i have seen plenty of family spend more time fighting over stuff than bereave. sad, but true

[3:54:30 PM] nsy says: most people are not as emotionally mature as your family, AE. they will run higher on emotion than rationality, so the more decisions that are made for them, the better. Reaux Sham Beaux

[3:55:45 PM] nsy says: my sisters love each other, but they didn't speak for almost 3 months over the bed. then they realized it is silly, and gave it to a third party. if someone had made the decision for them, their angst could have been directed elsewhere, sparing an unnecessary rift.

[3:56:18 PM] nsy says: my description about running high on emotion refers to people who are grieving - not in general

[3:56:34 PM] pD says: to throw in another wrinkle, for the items that are high value and need a certainly maintenance and wanted by multiple people. what do you do?

[3:57:00 PM] nsy says: liquidate

[3:57:15 PM] pD says: in other words, if there is a painting that should be kept in a dry environment but one person wants it but cannot maintain it

[3:57:35 PM] pD says: so, majority rule?

[3:57:59 PM] nsy says: if the vote is anonymous

[3:58:18 PM] pD says: how about throw in the first right of refusal so that the person who really wants it can buy it

[3:58:48 PM] pD says: oh, i don't like the anonymous voting part - there are too many ways to game the system by forming cliques

[3:59:02 PM] pD still the schmuck

[3:59:54 PM] nsy says: but its better than having everyone hate each other for being voted against - then instead of cliques, you have "sides"

[4:00:24 PM] AE says: i say donate it.

[4:01:08 PM] AE says: some museum out there would love to have it, it would make a great tax write off against death tax, lots of people can see it, and you can have a plaque that says it was donated by your family.

[4:01:40 PM] AE says: that's what my grandfather is doing with my grandmother's multimillion dollar Hummel collection.

[4:02:03 PM] AE says: There is a museum in Tyler TX that has a few but was looking for a complete collection. Volia.

[4:03:01 PM] AE says: Now my grandfather gets rid of a massive collection and gets a huge tax write-off; the museum is happy, and the collection is well cared for and on display for everyone.

[4:03:07 PM] pD says: who is hummel?

[4:03:31 PM] pD says: so, what is the thread hold for donate/liquidate an item?

[4:03:38 PM] AE says: this decision was made before my grandmother died... so I recommend doing the same for any large ticket items: have them explicitly laid out in the will...

[4:03:45 PM] AE says: hummel are figurines...

[4:04:56 PM] AE says: http://www.mihummel.com/

[4:05:00 PM] pD says: how about creating an internal auction process and whoever bids the highest gets the item. and, the proceed can go to a pre-designated charity or some such

[4:05:03 PM] AE says: I don't know what the threshold is.

[4:05:57 PM] AE says: what kind of stuff are we talking about? Is this a lot of high dollar stuff?

[4:06:19 PM] AE says: if so, you can liquidate it in auction, public or private, and either split or donate the proceeds.

[4:06:36 PM] AE says: that incurs additional expense, though.

[4:06:48 PM] AE says: and work of getting everything ready for auction.

[4:07:03 PM] AE says: you're better off getting a clear will/trust in the first place.

[4:07:06 PM] AE says: or better yet...

[4:07:13 PM] AE says: NOT have really expensive things!

[4:07:19 PM] AE says: that would be the best solution.

[4:07:43 PM] AE says: that's what we're going for here.

[4:10:38 PM] pD says: oh, i am just posing all the hypothetical questions. you know, try to see what are the kinks and how to game the system. mind experiment if you will

[4:11:54 PM] pD says: how do we take into account if somebody really really cares for an item whereas another member may just want the item for its monetary value? auction may fetch higher prices, but does it make the family happier?

[4:13:01 PM] AE says: our only large possession is property. once we die, that will go into reverse mortgage paid off to the children (unless they are under 18, then the grandparents or trustee takes over until the kids are of age.

[4:13:52 PM] pD says: that is an interesting idea on reverse mortgage. why not just sell it and split the proceeds?

[4:14:05 PM] AE says: taxes

[4:14:23 PM] AE says: if you sell it you have to pay tax on it unless you use the proceeds to purchase another house.

[4:14:45 PM] AE says: if you reverse mortgage it, the income from it is spread out over the term of the mortgage.

[4:15:01 PM] AE says: of course, at the end either the bank gets the house or the kids have to buy it back.

[4:15:09 PM] AE says: so... there goes the family homestead.

[4:15:26 PM] AE says: but, what child is going to want to stay in the house their parents built?

[4:16:10 PM] AE says: as for the emotion/monetary angle... I don't know a good solution there... look in your heart for the answer...

[4:16:26 PM] AE says: attachment is the root of all evil.

[4:16:36 PM] AE says: attachment to money, to things, to people...

[4:16:43 PM] pD says: that is why i strive to spend everything i have got to spare my heir the agony

[4:16:53 PM] AE says: all of us can stand to practice non-attachment.

[4:17:07 PM] AE says: especially during that time!

[4:17:13 PM] AE says: heh

[4:18:19 PM] pD says: well, technically, if the property is willed, the cost basis gets step up for the heir, so the tax consequence should be minimum, unless it is a really big house. this seems to give the heir more options - if they want to keep the house, for example

[4:43:32 PM] AE says: but if there are multiple heirs that may not work. They would want to either liquidate it to split the value, or one would have to buy the other out.

[4:44:23 PM] AE says: and any house in California these days is some serious value (ours is presently 3-4 times it's original value).

[4:45:06 PM] AE says: so if the property is willed, you need to ensure there are adequate liquid assets to offset the value for other siblings.

[4:45:14 PM] AE says: that can be tricky with the changing markets.

[4:45:22 PM] AE says: so the best bet is to liquidate it.

[4:45:35 PM] AE says: and the best way I've found to do that is to reverse mortgage it.

[4:45:53 PM] AE says: my logic often paints me into these situations were I have no free will.

[4:45:59 PM] AE says: same reason I drive a prius...

[4:46:21 PM] AE says: would rather have a WRX STI or Porche Turbo AWD.

[4:46:33 PM] pD says: free will is over-rated - deterministic world view is much more comforting

[4:46:37 PM] AE says: but that would not be the logical choice.

[4:46:50 PM] AE says: how so?

[4:47:16 PM] pD says: your logic definitely makes sense - on the house anyway, i don't know about your car choices - personally, i would prefer a bentley

[4:47:47 PM] pD says: but, it (ref: house) does beg the question, why make the determination today as oppose to letting your heir decide?

[4:50:32 PM] nsy says: because you might get into a situation like the one i had where I wanted to keep the house, and my sisters wanted to liquidate. I didn’t have enough money to buy them out, so we sold it under market value to get the estate stuff done with. that was 2001. the house has almost quadrupled in value since then. but no for us... then again, it is a unique market situation. can't bet on that happening again - but you never know.

[4:51:41 PM] nsy says: if it was legally determined, at least i wouldn't have to fight the urge to say "i told you so!"

[4:53:01 PM] pD says: i hear you. but, in the context of the reverse mortgage, you would have "sold" the house anyway. of course, you do retain the upside option of buying it back should the value goes up. You may not have thought of this option back then, but, had you known, you probably would/should have gone with that route

[4:53:33 PM] pD says: so, my point is , since we are talking about options - why lock in so early if it is just a question of making sure that the heirs are properly informed?

[4:55:07 PM] nsy says: 1 - you never know when you’ll go and 2 - people don’t think straight when they lose a loved one, so you have to think it out before then. or maybe i didn’t understand your question...?

[4:56:31 PM] pD says: that is a fair point. so, i think one of the to-do's is to get enough life insurance and estate planning in order so that the heir have time to think instead of being rushed

[4:56:57 PM] AE says: get the big items sorted out at least.

[4:57:15 PM] pD says: and, assuming that there is a bit of breathing room in terms of timeframe for reflection, research, etc., would that help?

[4:57:48 PM] AE says: usually these things happen all too fast.

[4:58:05 PM] AE says: often everyone gets together for the funeral and wants to do it all then.

[4:58:08 PM] AE says: bad idea.

[4:58:25 PM] AE says: the law gives you 6 months before you need to execute the will and donate items.

[4:58:42 PM] AE says: you have 1 year from the time of death to reconcile real estate.

[4:59:22 PM] pD says: that is very interesting about the time line. are they california specific or nation-wide?

[4:59:39 PM] AE says: i'm not sure. I know it was true in Colorado and Texas.

[4:59:55 PM] AE says: oh, and california, so it's probably a federal rule.

[4:59:56 PM] pD says: i should find out

[5:00:10 PM] AE says: having kids does this to people.

[5:00:30 PM] AE says: Quinn was about 12 months when we got our trust/will, living will, and trust funds set up.

[5:00:46 PM] pD says: if it wasn't for the fact that my kid is so darn cute, it just ain't worth it

[5:01:01 PM] AE says: that's why nature makes them that way.

[5:01:31 PM] AE says: so at 3am when he's screaming and projectile vomiting you don't stick him in the freezer...

[5:01:43 PM] AE says: not that that would ever happen.

[5:01:45 PM] AE says: or did.

[5:01:49 PM] AE says: not.

[5:01:54 PM] AE says: you know what I mean.

[5:02:06 PM] pD says: freezer is too full with frozen breast milk anyway. he would not fit

[5:02:33 PM] pD says: no fighting mother nature there

[5:03:20 PM] AE says: ah... I miss those days...

[5:03:38 PM] AE says: we just tossed the last of the swim diapers and gave away the potty equipment...

[5:03:47 PM] AE waxes nostalgic

[5:03:49 PM] pD says: psycho!

[5:04:04 PM] AE says: eh?

[5:04:11 PM] pD says: missing those days...

[5:04:33 PM] pD says: rather masochistic, wouldn't you say

[5:05:42 PM] AE says: you'll get there some day.. .trust me.

[5:07:29 PM] pD thinking out loud - somebody is showing an awfully lot of attachment

[5:12:37 PM] pD says: btw

[5:13:16 PM] pD says: as an aside, thank you for sharing your experiences. i have been thinking about it

[5:13:30 PM] pD says: but, it is good to do a sanity check with reality and people who have gone through it

[5:14:10 PM] AE says: of course! always happy to inflate my ego at the expense of others!

[5:18:39 PM] nsy says: late with this comment - didn’t want to interrupt your nostalgia - anyway....a non-financial example of why you need to decide everything ahead of time: it was a big rush, and we scattered all of dad's ashes at the service, then later wished we had parceled out some of them to the other loved ones, and retained some to scatter during our world travels... there was also limited room on the boat for the scattering, and since it was not pre-determined who would go, we all had to awkwardly decide at the moment of departure, and some pushy people that were not even family took the place of family on the boat. please decide everything for them so they do not have to deal with that stuff. i still feel a little guilty about pushing them overboard ;-}

[5:19:17 PM] AE says: *snicker*

[5:20:05 PM] AE says: true though. after the death comes planning the funeral/memorial. At that time people often want to divvy things up.

[5:20:42 PM] AE says: my mom's death was kind of like that, except we had all been through so much together watching her struggle that it never occurred to any of us to act in a way that was not beneficial to the whole group.

[5:20:53 PM] AE says: altruistic, perhaps... but it's what happened.

[5:21:16 PM] AE says: I still have un-scattered ashes to deal with. but it's kind of nice having them around.

[5:21:34 PM] AE says: we put some under the fruit trees we planted this year.

[5:21:48 PM] AE says: and i sprinkle some on runs through areas my mom would have loved.

[5:24:47 PM] nsy says: maybe you can bake her into a cake? sorry - maybe thats morbid. i sometimes rub people the wrong way with that stuff.

[5:24:58 PM] nsy says: in your case i'm sure its the wonderful influence your Mother had, and how great your family is. and in other cases, maybe when you know that someone is sick, and there is a possibility of loss, you begin to process these things early. but when it is a surprise like it was for us - there is so much more potential for craziness (i think).

[5:25:24 PM] nsy says: or maybe we are just a-holes

[5:28:49 PM] nsy says: it would be nice to be planted under fruit trees that your family will eat from - and maybe a rose bush or two. or a redwood tree. ahhh

[5:29:00 PM] nsy says: you had some great ideas there

[5:29:40 PM] AE says: we could bake her into a cake we make with the apples picked from the tree growing over her ashes...

[5:29:52 PM] AE says: wonder what ashes would taste like...

[5:30:46 PM] AE says: or we could do something else with them: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/entertainment/6524661.stm

[5:30:54 PM] AE says: but we don't do drugs...

[5:32:39 PM] nsy says: hahaha - classic!

[5:33:07 PM] nsy says: ok, i'm outta here - thanks for the brain food. this is good stuff!

[5:34:24 PM] AE says: me too. night all!

==
NSA Chatters crew

Monday, June 25, 2007

science fiction - b movie - ranking - pirates - cheerleading - pom-pom - jackson pollock

[10:38:03 AM] pD says: just realized that it is June 25th!

[10:38:17 AM] pD says: hate it! nearly half of year is gone and i have not done anything

[10:39:17 AM] nsy says: half a year since...?

[10:39:26 AM] nsy says: oh, 2007

[10:39:29 AM] pD says: since half year ago...

[10:39:56 AM] pD says: as a kid, i always felt time moved too slow. now, it is the reverse.

[10:40:54 AM] nsy says: heh. the 4th dimension is a silly place. tomorrow is my one-year at our current workplace, and i haven't done anything either - so don't feel bad

[11:01:38 AM] pD says: 4th dimension sucks, it only goes in one direction for mere mortals like me

[11:18:08 AM] nsy says: for now...

[11:18:34 AM] nsy says: until we make our 4th dimension travel machine

[11:25:25 AM] pD says: actually, i already do, but it is a hassle to get everyone on the same bus...

[11:25:43 AM] pD has changed the chat topic to "anti-environmental science fiction"

[11:26:05 AM] pD says: so, i just came up with a new sci-fi idea

[11:26:37 AM] pD says: as nano technology improves, RFID tags are nano-nized

[11:27:08 AM] pD says: and, as wal-mart leads the charge to put RFID on everything, the world is now tagged with nano RFID

[11:28:08 AM] pD says: in parallel, bio-science is developing all the sequence of RNA and people are now theorizing the possible of creating artificial intelligence using tinny bits of information like DNA/RNA

[11:28:22 AM] pD says: as the world develops, everyone is now onto re-cycling

[11:28:47 AM] pD says: then, in the recycling center, all the nano RFID are mixed and combined through out the process

[11:29:08 AM] pD says: so, like the scientists predicted, this inadvertently created new life forms

[11:30:38 AM] pD says: that is the basic idea - the rest becomes a narrative

[11:31:16 AM] nsy says: maybe Troma films will produce your movie as a Toxic Avenger sequel

[11:32:45 AM] pD says: but, in this story, everyone is doing the right thing - human recycling is the "cause"

[11:33:01 AM] pD says: RFID makes the world more efficient

[11:33:41 AM] pD says: Nano technology and bio-tech development improves quality of life through smaller physical footprint and better/targeted medicine

[11:34:39 AM] pD says: besides, there is no predisposition on the new life form is necessarily a bad thing - that is a moral judgment that would need to determine by the narrative

[11:37:45 AM] nsy says: if you're not doing a "b" movie where the audience is supposed to assume that the premise is true as a pre-cursor to the story, then i want to know how the rna/dna chips come to be "alive".

[11:38:56 AM] pD says: well, i am thinking of a "B" movie format, the above was pretty much the background info. what i am struggling is what the narrative would be, because it is too easy to become an anti-technology/development story line

[11:39:01 AM] pD says: now, about how the combine thing works

[11:39:10 AM] pD says: actually, i have a few theories

[11:39:19 AM] pD says: DNA works with ATGC pairs

[11:39:36 AM] pD says: each can only combine with specific counterpart

[11:40:03 AM] pD says: RNA, i am not as sure, but it is similar idea - but the current speculation is that RNA is really the mojo of life in the eye so human

[11:40:24 AM] pD says: in other words, most living forms have similar DNA structure - think hardware

[11:40:41 AM] pD says: but RNA is the OS that makes decisions on the various wirings and capabilities

[11:40:56 AM] pD says: now, back to how the chip combinations would work.

[11:41:20 AM] pD says: first off, it would have to be carbon based - this makes the chips "organic" (chemically speaking)

[11:42:01 AM] pD says: there are any number of reasons why human would want to make the chips organic - chiefly because it makes the chip flexible.

[11:43:19 AM] pD says: the other part is standardization, as wal-mart's of the world standardize on RFID, there is likely to come up with a standard set of designs much like ATGC

[11:43:45 AM] pD says: the final ingredient is nano-nization, which is another thing that is being pushed hard on

[11:43:59 AM] nsy says: http://nanotechlaw.blogspot.com/2007_01_01_archive.html

[11:44:08 AM] pD says: nano-nization makes it possible to create very basic blocks

[11:44:46 AM] pD says: so, in sum, these are the pieces that makes the leap of "recycling" as the primordial soup of life quite "plausible"

[11:48:18 AM] nsy says: fascinating. ok, i'll go see that b movie. whats the narrative, then?

[11:48:41 AM] pD says: well, that is the part that i struggle with

[11:49:24 AM] pD says: the initial creation of the organic-chip based life form would be fairly small and not a lot of "intelligence" beyond survival. but, that does that mean?

[11:49:45 AM] nsy says: amoeba?

[11:50:02 AM] pD says: sure

[11:50:44 AM] pD says: or, to make it "interesting" for the story, we can fast forward on their development from amoeba to XYZ, but what is that background story?

[11:59:44 AM] AE says: wait....

[12:00:10 PM] AE says: it's a B movie about RNA/DNA forming from RFID, and now you're throwing in XYZ....

[12:00:17 PM] AE says: too many acronyms... it will never work.

[12:01:00 PM] AE fades away again.

[12:01:24 PM] pD says: XYZ is a yet to be determined name for the being arising out of nano-RFID life form that human has to deal with on a (more or less) equal basis

[12:01:33 PM] nsy says: so, lets leave that part on the cutting room floor, and just get on to the meaty part

[12:02:34 PM] pD says: so, my assumption is that the initial creation of NR (nano-RFID) amoeba was not detected

[12:02:56 PM] pD says: so, while human congratulate themselves on being enlightened and efficient, etc., NR is being created

[12:03:00 PM] pD says: en masse

[12:03:45 PM] pD says: so, first question, what happens to their equals? do they cooperate with existing amoebas or do they act more like predators?

[12:04:43 PM] AE says: all life strives to survive.

[12:04:53 PM] AE says: so they would be predators.

[12:05:19 PM] AE says: but easy to track predators.

[12:05:24 PM] nsy says: but if they are all predators, who wins?

[12:05:35 PM] pD says: survival does not require predatory tendency - lot of beings, smaller ones usually, tend to survive better by cooperating

[12:05:43 PM] AE says: eventually our hero's learn they can track the RFID signals and are able to create a nano-hunter.

[12:06:01 PM] AE says: but that makes for bad horror/fiction.

[12:06:14 PM] AE says: "and everyone lived in cooperative harmony"

[12:06:21 PM] AE says: NOT!

[12:07:05 PM] nsy says: i guess their behavior at amoeba stage depends on the point you are trying to convey later in the film

[12:07:14 PM] nsy says: which is...?

[12:07:20 PM] pD says: i think it would be much more interesting to make NR being a more complex being. Otherwise, it becomes too easy to objectify them as the ruthless enemy and become yet another channel for human aggression

[12:07:42 PM] pD says: well, that is what is struggling with, what/where is the point that i want to reach?

[12:08:06 PM] pD says: i am not suggesting that it becomes a lovey-dovey thing - complexity is good

[12:09:07 PM] pD says: lunch time - brb

[12:12:58 PM] pD says: so, here are two routes that i can think of

[12:14:16 PM] pD says: one is that NR becomes integrated into the overall human-centric environment and replaces functions that is currently taken up by bacteria - digestion, etc.

[12:14:46 PM] pD says: the other is that NR develops its own biological tree and becomes distinct specie

[12:17:34 PM] pD says: one question that i cannot answer/decide is how does NR produce offspring. can it be done outside of the nano-RFID context. If yes, then, NR has to live closely to human footprint. or, they can develop separately

[12:17:39 PM] pD says: any thoughts?

[12:20:35 PM] nsy says: i don't see as many options for an exciting conclusion with the integration option... unless its the integrate - then take over scenario.

[12:27:36 PM] pD says: or, it creates two classes of human - the super-NR type and the regular

[12:28:09 PM] pD says: then, it could be the two classes duking it out, or maybe NR allies with regular to fight super-NR human?

[12:28:18 PM] nsy says: maybe they can reproduce by taking over stem cells and duplicating their genetic pattern - um, somehow. well, it's "b" sci-fi, right?

[12:29:35 PM] pD says: stem-cell, that is brilliant! since it would be carbon based and there is every incentive to "enhance" the stem cell with additional capabilities

[12:29:54 PM] pD says: the drawback, however, is that would the story line take an anti-stem cell stance?

[12:33:45 PM] nsy says: i'm pro stem cell usage, so, in the end, maybe humans will also have to use stem cells to "fight fire with fire" or some other cheezy catch-phrase.

[12:35:00 PM] nsy says: but then maybe its getting a little too cliche. not sure

[1:01:06 PM] AE says: the NR could also look to WalMar for fresh FRID-DNA...

[1:01:10 PM] AE says: *RFID...

[1:01:16 PM] AE says: I'm fried!

[1:01:30 PM] AE vs Apollo... Apollo wins!

[1:04:22 PM] AE says: it was really hot out today

[1:04:32 PM] AE says: in centigrade... that means REALLY HOT!

[1:09:04 PM] pD says: how about in kelvins?

[1:15:41 PM] AE says: I wear boxers, not kelvins...

[1:16:21 PM] pD says: too much details

[1:23:36 PM] pD has changed the chat topic to "google ranking slut"

[1:23:54 PM] pD says: noticed that NSA Chatters is coming up on regular google search every so often

[1:33:06 PM] pD says: as i am reasonably familiar with how google works, i am fascinated to see how the search engine would place this blog. after all, there is no obvious topic for a category

[1:35:48 PM] nsy says: have to reboot - be back soon...

[1:37:13 PM] pD says: that was weird, the last entry was missing from the blogspot location

[1:37:19 PM] pD says: just went in and re-published it

[1:37:28 PM] pD says: loved those pirate flags

[1:43:49 PM] nsy says: Aye, pirate flags are always fun

[1:44:44 PM] pD says: did we ever get too far on doing our own pirate flag?

[1:45:35 PM] pD says: btw, the flag voting is stagnating at 28 votes. should we aim for 30+ to reflect popular will or should we consider it good enough? http://www.blogpoll.com/poll/view_Results.php?poll_id=117595

[1:46:19 PM] nsy says: good nuff for me

[1:47:37 PM] AE says: Ok. I'll go vote a few times then.

[1:47:52 PM] pD says: that is the spirit!

[1:48:20 PM] pD says: if we do not stuff the ballot box, we make no good pirates

[1:51:03 PM] AE says: arrr... depends on what yer stuffin' it with...

[1:51:19 PM] AE says: I hide all me dabloons in mine.

[1:51:34 PM] AE says: but now you all know that, so i'll have to keel ya.

[1:51:59 PM] pD says: arr... arr... arr.....\

[1:52:08 PM] pD says: just like saying "arrrrr...."

[1:57:05 PM] pD says: clears the throat quite nicely

[2:04:01 PM] nsy says: rra raa raa

[2:04:09 PM] nsy says: i'm a dyslexic pirate

[2:05:56 PM] nsy says: http://www.oregonlive.com/edge/index.ssf?/edge/2003/20030919.frame

[2:09:55 PM] nsy says: http://www.cafepress.com/jbsoriginals.31375942

[2:58:55 PM] pD says: hahah! water coming out of my nose!

[2:59:06 PM] pD says: Dyslexic pirates

Make outstanding cheerleaders.

Their cry rings out, "Rahhhh!"

- by Brett Slater, Bangor, Maine

[2:59:13 PM] pD says: pirate haiku

[2:59:46 PM] nsy says: my personal favorite as well

[3:27:01 PM] pD says: would pirates use pom-pom's?

[3:27:22 PM] pD says: say, maybe that is our pirate flag - skull with pom-poms!

[3:28:55 PM] nsy says: lol

[3:29:05 PM] AE says: yeah!

[3:29:25 PM] pD says: skull with NSA spelt with pmo-poms

[3:40:22 PM] nsy says: or maybe the cross-bones could be 2 pom-poms?

[3:41:30 PM] pD says: nsy, can you humor us with a few pom-pom images?

[3:49:56 PM] AE says: you have to be careful how you read that word, pom...

[3:52:03 PM] nsy says: i looked for a pirate cheer, but there are too many sporting teams names "pirates" - no luck - let me try images

[3:53:15 PM] pD says: pirates in pom-pom could do well

[3:57:16 PM] AE says: http://www.talklikeapirate.com/songs1.html

[4:01:21 PM] nsy says: http://www.blueribbonembroidery.com/cheer3.jpg

[4:02:48 PM] AE says: yea, but that pom means something else...

[4:03:27 PM] nsy says: lol - http://www.talklikeapirate.com/songs2.html#izodpirate

[4:03:50 PM] nsy says: its about cheerleading, right?

[4:04:11 PM] nsy says: see url

[4:04:35 PM] nsy says: http://www.detroitlionsstore.com/store/vendor2/thumbs/pompom2.jpg

[4:08:13 PM] AE says: oh, the izod pirate is a bad song....

[4:08:18 PM] AE says: bad. evil.

[4:08:21 PM] AE says: wicked.

[4:08:38 PM] AE says: I like this line though, from another song:

[4:08:40 PM] AE says:

There's a patch on me eye and there's stripes on me shirt

We're surrounded by water and still we find dirt

[4:08:49 PM] AE says: that sounds like me kids.

[4:18:19 PM] pD sent file "p2.JPG
" to members of this chat

[4:19:36 PM] nsy says: hahaha - thats hilarious

[4:20:18 PM] pD says: the alternative was to have pirates holding pom-poms in the formation of NSA. But, that is a bit too much work graphically.

[4:38:58 PM] pD says: so far this is the winning flag: https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjDPxqRJNXZF7eHjcLRgrwDomQvws351Y0PgeVX4ROMhBUBfKTaZDL7zQV9OlKRAmSmkmleMEWNqwctFdv7AMAypYOyXKOUeGX2DkuGpVSwa3WPuaqNhyphenhyphenBl-rBekMFF-DKW90LT61edIx0/s320/JR2.JPG

[4:39:03 PM] pD says: before the pom-poms

[5:03:06 PM] AE says: night all.

[5:04:37 PM] pD says: caio

[5:04:56 PM] nsy says: buh-bye

[5:11:57 PM] nsy says: http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoID=1711166700

[5:14:46 PM] pD says: i trust the feeling is mutual

[5:14:58 PM] pD says: actually, flight attendants cannot do much against you

[5:15:08 PM] pD says: the worst is if you piss of your waiter, oh boy!

[5:15:13 PM] pD says: things can get ugly

[5:16:02 PM] nsy says: exactly! i never understood those people who are cruel to their servers. you're really just hurting yourself

[5:17:13 PM] nsy says: i knew a guy who was a bartender, and he claims he never did it himself, but they would put visine in pepoles drinks if they were jerks. i guess it is like ex-lax.

[5:19:17 PM] pD says: does it work? Visine - i just saw that in "the wedding crasher"

[5:19:29 PM] pD says: not a horrible film if you have no expectation

[5:19:56 PM] pD says: i think visine is a lot of work, i have heard that they just spit in your food

[5:20:39 PM] nsy says: he said it really works

[5:20:56 PM] nsy says: but i can't speak from experience

[5:21:30 PM] nsy says: yah - vince vaughan is entertaining - if you have no expectation like you said

[5:22:38 PM] pD says: i thought he did a good job playing dumb in Mr Ms Smith

[5:23:02 PM] nsy says: i didn’t see that one yet

[5:23:04 PM] pD says: he plays a certain role very well. Not so good at others. but, that is one more than most of us non-Hollywood type.

[5:23:27 PM] nsy says: he did a good job in clay pigeons - an early role for him

[5:23:33 PM] pD says: i think i need to put it on my list, i saw it on a flight a while back, so it was quite butchered.

[5:23:35 PM] pD says: thanks for reminding me

[5:23:54 PM] nsy says: ;)

[5:31:39 PM] pD says: in case you have not seen, i highly recommend "Who the $#%& is Jackson Pollock?"

[5:32:12 PM] pD says: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0487092/

[5:41:45 PM] pD says: it makes the art establishment look silly

[5:42:00 PM] pD says: and, as we all know, anything that makes somebody look silly is a good thing

[5:43:04 PM] pD says: hmm...

[5:43:09 PM] pD says: just lost connection

[5:43:28 PM] pD says: am back

[5:41:55 PM] nsy: nice! i'll add that to my list - thanks

[5:42:10 PM] nsy says: yes, indeed

[5:46:32 PM] pD says: silly or jackson pollock

[5:46:37 PM] pD says: :)!

==
NSA Chatters crew

Friday, June 22, 2007

malware - non-runners - japanese game - buddha - pirates - la chapelle

[10:38:27 AM] AE says: so... here's what $1000 will buy you: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/6221306.stm

[10:39:01 AM] AE says: It's Mpack, a commercially sold maleware kit.

[10:39:11 AM] AE says: even comes with a year of tech support! And updates!

[10:41:28 AM] pD says: that is so cool, do they come with sample codes?

[10:44:12 AM] AE says: I don't know.

[10:44:24 AM] AE says: here's Panda's article on it: http://blogs.pandasoftware.com/blogs/pandalabs/archive/2007/05/03/Cybercrime_2E002E002E00_-for-sale-_2800_II_2900_.aspx

[10:48:05 AM] AE says: so you can see, there is fierce competition out there.

[10:48:23 AM] AE says: so that means there's still big money happening in this sector.

[10:48:30 AM] AE says: which means... large file transfers!

[10:54:07 AM] nsy says: woo hoo!

[10:55:30 AM] AE says: must run.

[10:56:53 AM] nsy says: or you'll disappear into another dimension in time and space

[10:57:31 AM] pD says: we should form a club of non-runners

[10:58:08 AM] nsy says: what will we do at meetings?

[10:58:35 AM] AE says: eat ice cream?

[10:58:45 AM] nsy says: i'm IN!

[10:59:06 AM] AE says: you could buy Segway's and chase runners.

[10:59:22 AM] AE says: threaten them with fatty treats!

[11:00:03 AM] AE says: "Run faster! Or I'll force this pint of Haagen Das Super Mega Ultra Chocolate down your throat!"

[11:01:06 AM] pD says: that sounds like work - chasing runners

[11:01:43 AM] pD says: we will have a giant running mill in the meeting room where we invite runners to generate power for our cooling boxes where treats are stored

[11:02:13 AM] pD says: and, since this will be a symbiotic relationship, we will cheer the runner on

[11:05:59 AM] nsy says: pD, you never cease to amuse me!

[11:06:04 AM] nsy says: lol

[11:08:26 AM] nsy says: maybe instead of the mill, we can have a ...http://www.gameops.com/spot/promo/hamster.php

[11:09:22 AM] pD says: pD == full of cheap tricks

[11:09:33 AM] pD == cheap tricks

[11:11:06 AM] nsy says: http://www.gameops.com/assets/video/hamster.htm

[11:17:31 AM] pD says: sorry, cannot see it

[11:19:09 AM] nsy says: darn. well, if you go to the first url, there's a link on the page for a video of the human hamster ball in action - somewhat amusing, but could be better, so don't invest too much effort

[11:20:44 AM] nsy says: try this one http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5651646248594444703&q=human+hamster+ball&total=22&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0

[11:21:22 AM] pD says: speaking of silly videos

[11:21:42 AM] pD says: you should check out this human tetris game on a japanese game show

[11:21:46 AM] pD says: hilarious

[11:21:47 AM] pD says: http://www.glumbert.com/media/japtetris

[11:22:05 AM] pD says: AE found it last friday: http://nsa-chatters.blogspot.com/2007/06/kids-not-walking-google-ranking.html

[12:32:14 PM] AE says: you know that fat and happy picture of Buddha we always see?

[12:32:26 PM] AE says: well here he is after fasting for a while: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:EmaciatedBuddha.JPG

[12:36:08 PM] AE says: somehow that's more in line with my image of the Buddha.

[12:36:36 PM] AE says: if you're enlightened, do you care about things like hygiene? how you look? how you act?

[12:41:35 PM] nsy says: wow, i find that disturbing for some reason.

[12:42:53 PM] nsy says: i thought buddha was like that in the beginning under the tree, but after he was enlightened, people came to him and brought food to hear his teaching, and so many people came to listen, that he was fat from the offerings. or did i make that up in my head?

[12:43:55 PM] nsy says: so only a buddha whose enlightenment went to waste because nobody wanted to listen would be emaciated... wow, ok. art in action - i get it now.

[12:48:14 PM] AE says: this was supposed to be right after he achieved enlightenment... so perhaps he was so starved afterwards that he ate all the offerings and became the fat and happy Buddha.

[12:48:26 PM] AE says: but this is still my favorite image of him to date.

[12:48:38 PM] pD says: hi nsy, i think the fat buddha actually refers to a different buddha

[12:48:51 PM] pD says: i do not know the Sanskrit name, i will try to find it

[12:49:28 PM] nsy says: gonna get my learn on!

[12:49:34 PM] pD says: of "the" buddha, being thin is one of the standard images which refers to his time under the bunian tree

[12:49:53 PM] pD says: here is also one where he is on his side - that refers to his death

[12:50:29 PM] pD says: one where he is touching the ground - refers to his invincibility (i9n the face of temptation)

[12:50:43 PM] pD says: one where he opens his palm toward you - no fear

[12:50:59 PM] pD says: one where he touches middle and thumb - teaching

[12:51:09 PM] pD says: i think these are the usually/common ones

[12:51:37 PM] AE says: i always thought the different hand positions referred to modra's...

[12:51:56 PM] nsy says: i can see the beauty in emaciated buddha if it supposed to be right after enlightenment, because it reflects the struggle to achieve that goal.

[12:52:18 PM] AE says: yes! exactly!

[12:52:30 PM] AE says: this, to me, is a person who has been on a quest.

[12:52:41 PM] nsy says: modras - please feed my brain!

[12:52:45 PM] AE says: i hope to look like that some day.

[12:52:56 PM] AE says: sorry... mudra? hand meditations.

[12:53:30 PM] AE says: http://www.onmarkproductions.com/html/mudra-japan.shtml

[12:53:35 PM] pD says: mantras - religious symbols

[12:54:10 PM] AE says: they are more than that. there are whole meditations based on a series of hand mudra's

[12:54:28 PM] AE says: you combine them with pranayama when meditating

[12:54:35 PM] pD says: i am a non-believer, so that's start with that

[12:54:54 PM] AE says: it's not a belief thing. that's like saying "i don't believe in karate."

[12:54:56 PM] pD says: i think mundras's power comes from within - if you believe it, it works

[12:55:18 PM] AE says: no... it's a path. similar to tai chi.

[12:55:22 PM] pD says: oh, i am referring to buddha's gestures above

[12:55:47 PM] AE says: you do the movements, they cause reaction within the body. there is nothing metaphysical about it.

[12:55:56 PM] AE says: similar to acupuncture.

[12:56:29 PM] pD says: when i view religious arts or artifacts, i tend to focus on its story because it is a context that the artist is trying to convey

[12:57:27 PM] nsy says: interesting stuff -thanks!

[1:04:01 PM] AE says: here's a completely different set of images: http://www.weestoriestheatre.org/treasureisland/pirateinfo3.jpg

[1:04:42 PM] AE says: these are some of the flags that actual pirates used. You'll be happy to see ours is there: the Calico Jack Rackham.

[1:05:04 PM] AE says: arrr.

[1:05:04 PM] pD says: cool!

[1:05:19 PM] pD says: should we come up with our own then?

[1:05:31 PM] AE says: sure!

[1:05:32 PM] nsy says: of course!

[1:05:50 PM] AE says: oh, and from now on we should only communicate while typing on this: http://www.deanesmay.com/files/deanesmay-piratekeyboard.1.jpg

[1:06:06 PM] AE says: R!rr! rrr! Avast! R!

[1:06:47 PM] nsy says: LOL!

[1:08:30 PM] AE says: Ye scurvy dog! thar be no L's or O's on yer official keyboard!

[1:09:03 PM] nsy says: but yerrrs has scurvy - eew!

[1:09:22 PM] nsy says: do you think she gets parrot poo on her shoulder? http://realneo.us/system/files?file=pirateday.JPG

[1:09:45 PM] nsy says: http://www.tomarken.com/content/crit/articles/2005/pirate.gif

[1:09:59 PM] pD backtracking

[1:10:15 PM] pD says: Maitreya is the name of the chunky buddha

[1:10:25 PM] pD says: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Maitreya_and_discilples_carving_in_Feilai_Feng_Caves.jpg

[1:10:33 PM] pD says: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maitreya_Buddha

[1:10:40 PM] pD resume normal programming

[1:12:19 PM] pD says: what was that film about a submarine where one of the sailors strap a dead chicken on his shoulder in lieu of a parrot?

[1:12:43 PM] pD says: we should strap something - preferably machine washable

[1:13:11 PM] nsy says: i would remember if i'd seen that! i wish that was my idea!

[1:15:05 PM] nsy says: pirate fact and fiction: http://www.tqnyc.org/NYC051310/piratesfactfromfiction.htm

[1:16:09 PM] nsy says: se the section on parrots: "

Parrots were probably associated with pirates because of the book "Treasure Island". A character from that book named Long-John Silver, who was a pirate, had a parrot for a pet. This idea, however, caused a great deal of controversy because many people think that the parrots would of gotten in the way of the work that had to be done.

Many people believe that a parrot permanently perched on a pirates shoulder would start a mess and during hard times at sea the parrot would most likely be eaten. So it was very unlikely that a pirate traveled with a parrot or any other pet."

[1:16:57 PM] nsy says: so, we need something washable and edible that doesn't get in the way or make a mess

[1:17:16 PM] pD says: M7M's?

[1:17:23 PM] pD says: M&M's, i mean

[1:17:57 PM] AE says: R&R's?

[1:18:10 PM] nsy says: well, i haven't tried them in the washing machine, but they may be as close as we can get.

[1:18:21 PM] nsy says: hehehha

[1:18:26 PM] AE says: they're supposed to melt only in your mouth...

[1:18:34 PM] nsy says: true...

[1:18:36 PM] AE says: but I have a feeling the rinse cycle would do them in.

[1:18:49 PM] AE says: not to mention the dryer...say, that sounds kind of interesting...

[1:18:55 PM] nsy says: hmmm

[1:19:24 PM] AE motions nsy to the other chat client for a moment (work, sorry)

[2:11:40 PM] nsy says: gotta do some more network troubleshooting for this customer - talk to y'all later! if you go be fore i get back - have a great weekend!

[2:14:06 PM] AE says: Ok. I'm heading out soon as well. Traffic is murder on Fridays!

[2:15:07 PM] nsy says: i hear ya! safe travels. i'm working from home monday because i originally asked for it off, but frankis on the road, so i'll just work from home

[2:15:15 PM] nsy says: bye :)

[3:00:11 PM] pD says: drinking wine right now

[3:00:29 PM] pD says: AE did not like its smell - too much alcohol

[3:00:51 PM] pD says: more for me!

[3:04:37 PM] nsy says: have some for me! but just a little bit ;)

[3:04:49 PM] pD says: do you drink?

[3:05:22 PM] nsy says: sometimes

[3:05:51 PM] pD says: like you more already

[3:06:00 PM] nsy says: what is your poison?

[3:06:18 PM] pD says: expensive ones

[3:06:24 PM] pD says: one time

[3:06:46 PM] pD says: BIB (benevolent illustrious boss) asked me which wine I would like to try

[3:07:06 PM] nsy says: heh

[3:07:49 PM] pD says: anyway, i figure that i should try one that i have not had before - the other choice (do not remember which was a good one, I knew that already)

[3:08:15 PM] nsy says: hmmm my wireless just flaked out, sorry - talk to you soon :)

[3:08:33 PM] pD says: it turns out that i really enjoyed the "mystery wine"

[3:09:19 PM] nsy says: hmm - sounds better than special sauce, i suppose

[3:10:05 PM] nsy says: gotta call a customer back - see you later

[3:12:14 PM] pD says: it was the la chapelle wine I told you about: http://nsa-chatters.blogspot.com/2007/06/jolly-roger-vote-chocolate-la-chapelle.html

[3:14:28 PM] pD says: it turns out that it was considered one of the best wines in the last 20 years or so

[3:18:34 PM] pD says: in other words, i am either very lucky in liking the wine or i actually notice good wine

[3:18:40 PM] pD says: hard to say which though...

===
NSA Chatters crew

Thursday, June 21, 2007

Darth Vader - re-colonization - troops - bastards

[12:13:07 PM] pD says: i thought about the darth vader script and decided to change the ending a bit

[12:13:29 PM] pD says: basically, i want to make all the characters happy with the ending

[12:13:59 PM] pD says: so, instead of DV working in a sweat shop for air massage, he thinks that he has found his calling

[12:14:11 PM] pD says: so, the act 3 scene 2 sequence would be

[12:14:19 PM] pD says: 1. excited women for their regime

[12:14:29 PM] pD says: 2. Bakka-san and Nat counting money happily

[12:14:42 PM] pD says: 3. DV happily applying his air massage trade

[12:14:44 PM] pD says: the end

[12:15:00 PM] AE says: wait... vader was born on what planet?

[12:15:04 PM] AE says: tatooine...

[12:15:13 PM] AE says: so... does he have a green card?

[12:15:19 PM] AE says: you can see where this is going...

[12:18:38 PM] pD says: recall the enlightened alien colonizer discussion?

[12:18:40 PM] pD says: http://nsa-chatters.blogspot.com/2007/06/nsa-subpoena-re-colonization-jowels.html

[12:18:51 PM] pD says: maybe DV is one of the recolonizers?

[12:19:21 PM] pD in cheering outfit

[12:19:35 PM] pD says: DV! He so Cool!

[12:19:53 PM] pD says: Air massage recolonizers!

[12:19:58 PM] pD says: Go DV! Yeah!

[12:22:19 PM] pD says: btw, where is this going?

[12:22:34 PM] AE says: no, the NSA raids the massage shop. DV is brought into custody as an illegal alien and suspected terrorist (something about the black suit). Bakka-san's reputation and business is ruined. The women are in tears. End of story.

[12:22:56 PM] AE says: we'll label it as a comedy.

[12:23:54 PM] pD says: hahah! i like that

[12:24:00 PM] pD says: that would be act 4 though

[12:24:02 PM] AE says: or, the customers, led by Bakka-san and Nat, stage a break-out and spring DV from the NSA holding cell, and they live in fear for the rest of their lives.

[12:24:04 PM] AE says: Ok.

[12:24:50 PM] AE says: Or DV, while being held, can use his Jedi/Sith powers to begin to corrupt the NSA from within.

[12:25:11 PM] pD says: and, he only charges 7/8 of their souls

[12:25:23 PM] AE says: perhaps he can change into a tool of his own design... eventually he winds up in charge of the NSA.

[12:25:40 PM] AE says: instead of 9/8?

[12:30:42 PM] pD says: 9/8 is not a sustainable practice - gotta leave enough for the next round

[12:33:07 PM] AE says: oh... Ok...

[12:33:10 PM] AE pouts

[12:35:01 PM] pD says: i like the illegal alien angle for DV as a sequel though

[12:35:13 PM] pD says: sort of like "Cops"

[12:35:30 PM] AE says: you ever see "Troops"?

[12:35:48 PM] pD says: not yet, i have downloaded it, but i need to install quicktime

[12:36:40 PM] AE says: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5351101160052590481

[12:36:54 PM] AE says: that's on google video... don't think QT is required.

[1:15:03 PM] pD says: hahah! just watched it. it is brilliant!

[3:02:58 PM] nsy says: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXEhqd3la4s

[4:10:50 PM] pD says: anyone home?

[4:11:15 PM] nsy says: nobody here but us chickens.

[4:11:25 PM] nsy says: busy work day :\

[4:12:15 PM] pD says: i know what you mean, i was going to say something smart, but the smart juice ain't flowing

[5:38:06 PM] pD says: bastards!

[5:43:13 PM] nsy says: ok, gotta go - will read this tomorrow :(

[5:43:31 PM] pD says: double bastards

Wednesday, June 20, 2007

commandments - driving - center of universe - rubber side down - venereal disease - gutter

[11:19:38 AM] pD says: is AE on yahoo?

[11:20:01 AM] nsy says: not sure - my trillian is acting up - let me try again

[11:20:17 AM] pD says: no worries

[11:20:33 AM] pD says: any thought on the script rough draft?

[11:20:41 AM] nsy says: its back up - looks like he will be gone from 11-1

[11:21:05 AM] pD says: okay

[12:33:44 PM] pD says: The European Space Agency (Esa) is seeking volunteers for a simulated human trip to Mars, in which six crew spend 17 months in an isolation tank. : http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/6221424.stm

[12:34:24 PM] pD says: btw, can i invite ania?

[12:55:01 PM] pD says: The Vatican has issued a set of "10 commandments" for motorists to promote safer driving. : http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6768395.stm

[12:55:14 PM] pD says: i say we come up with our own 11 commandments

[1:01:05 PM] nsy says: sure - feel free to invite ania :)

[1:16:25 PM] nsy says: hmm, i believe in a separation of church and street

[1:17:42 PM] pD says: (rofl)

[1:18:05 PM] pD repeating "separation of church and street!"

[1:18:11 PM] pD is easily amused

[1:21:31 PM] pD added ANia to this chat

[1:21:54 PM] pD says: Introducing Ania who is on the phone with her family. she will grace us with her presence after the call

[1:22:13 PM] pD says: but, this begs the question of why is Ania's family up so late?

[1:22:55 PM] pD says: in the spirit of the separation of church and street, i would like to offer the first NSA Chatters commandment on driving

[1:23:12 PM] pD says: do not read the bible while driving

[1:23:54 PM] nsy says: thou shalt not tailgate

[1:24:31 PM] pD says: sorry, wrong phrasing - thou shalt not read the book

[1:24:58 PM] nsy says: haha

[1:26:09 PM] pD says: i would like to offer an amendment on the second suggestion which is - thou shalt not tailgate within 15 miles of pD

[1:27:28 PM] nsy says: contrary to popular belief, the concept of a pD-centric universe has not been scientifically proven

[1:29:15 PM] pD says: actually, that is not exactly correct

[1:29:40 PM] pD says: in the context of relativity, there is no concept of the "center of universe" per se

[1:29:53 PM] pD says: in other words, anywhere can be the center of universe

[1:30:26 PM] pD says: and, consistent with the scientific tradition, i would like to offer pD as the center of the universe

[1:30:51 PM] pD says: an onerous burden for most, but i shall take on the challenge and give it a go

[1:31:22 PM] pD says: and the world rejoices (dance)

[1:31:53 PM] pD says: and, for that work, i shall only charge for 7/8 of everyone's soul

[1:33:04 PM] pD says: commandment #3: thou shalt use turning signals

[1:42:05 PM] pD says: #4 thou shalt only drive at places that first responders can easily get to

[2:07:15 PM] AE says: #4a, and thou shalt carry thine own dang flares, cause they cost $8.49 ea.

[2:08:15 PM] AE says: #5 Thou shalt remember they are not cars; they're other drivers. Be kind.

[2:08:34 PM] pD says: #4b thou shalt avoid costing the first responder too much mulla

[2:09:13 PM] AE says: pD is the center of the pD centric universe, just as nsy and AE are at the center of their respective universes.

[2:09:15 PM] pD says: btw, do you have to pay for your own equipment or can uses be expensed with the state? seem like a reasonable thing to do - reimburse first responders

[2:09:49 PM] AE says: it used to be that the CHP would hand out flares like halloween candy at accident sites. Not any more,

[2:10:15 PM] AE says: so each driver that wishes to use them must purchase their own.

[2:11:06 PM] AE says: since i have the money, and the desire to help, i will gladly (but still complaining nosily) buy them.

[2:11:13 PM] pD says: #4c thou shalt drive in area where the first responders have not run out of flares

[2:11:35 PM] AE says: #6 Rubber side down.

[2:11:46 PM] pD says: #4d thou shalt think about sourcing cheap flares from china

[2:11:59 PM] AE says: haha! that might actually CAUSE accidents!

[2:12:12 PM] AE says: "honey, what's that burning smell?"

[2:12:18 PM] pD says: rubber side down? what does that mean

[2:12:36 PM] pD got caught trying to start BBQ fire without success

[2:13:55 PM] AE says: it refers to the side of the car that should be in contact with the road. (as opposed to roof side down)

[2:14:05 PM] AE says: it's a racing term.

[2:14:32 PM] pD says: but, i suppose on ice, roof side down may get you further faster

[2:20:15 PM] AE says: its not about further faster... it's about maintaining control of the vehicle.

[2:23:56 PM] pD thinks AE does not enjoy winter olympic sports such as bobsled

[2:25:22 PM] AE says: sure. they maintain control there too. i used to race downhill skiing in high school.

[2:25:54 PM] AE says: loved going fast down hill. but without control... trees eat the unwary.

[2:26:01 PM] pD says: so, the solution is to fit the controlling thingie on roof top.

[2:26:15 PM] AE says: true... if you have a sun roof and a rudder of some kind...

[2:26:28 PM] AE says: or out-riggers that could steer it.

[2:26:47 PM] AE says: or steerable rails on the top.

[2:26:54 PM] pD says: sails, that is the answer

[2:27:17 PM] pD says: porsche will get a spinnaker for higher speed performance

[2:27:20 PM] AE says: it's not propulsion we're looking for... it's direction control...

[2:38:12 PM] pD says: okay, we will throw in a rudder

[2:40:06 PM] pD says: #7 thou shalt on drive under influence of hubris - however induced

[2:41:28 PM] pD says: brb

[3:10:23 PM] pD says: c'est moi ici

[3:27:09 PM] AE says: I'm outta here. Bye.

[3:27:29 PM] pD says: ciao

[3:27:40 PM] pD says: still have not gotten to talk about darth vader

[3:27:46 PM] pD says: the illusive DV

[3:28:15 PM] pD says: i wonder how do you say VD in french, is it like DV?

[3:31:06 PM] pD says: VD (venereal disease) is "la maladie vénérienne" in french

[3:33:12 PM] pD says: turns out that i am looking for portuguese "doença venereal "

[3:33:30 PM] pD says: in russian "венерическое заболевание "

[3:33:59 PM] pD says: in japanese "性病"

[3:34:26 PM] pD says: in chinese "性病 " (same kanji as Japanese)

[3:34:52 PM] pD says: okay, i will stop now

[3:35:13 PM] pD trying hard to get his mind out of the gutter - the dark side is powerful

[4:36:53 PM] nsy says: that topic was a big influence on victorian culture that we were speaking of yesterday... oops, I didn't mean to encourage you!

[4:37:01 PM] nsy devil's advocate

[4:39:26 PM] pD says: the force is strong with this one

[5:41:41 PM] nsy says: well, it's been real. gotta run.

[5:42:45 PM] pD deep in thought, still fighting to get out of the gutter

[5:44:40 PM] nsy says: sorry so quiet today - been super busy - will meet you in the gutter again tomorrow

[5:44:56 PM] pD says: hey, watch it!

[5:44:59 PM] pD says: get your own gutter

[5:45:05 PM] pD says: i am getting comfortable here

[5:45:27 PM] pD says: and the stench is barely noticeable by now

[5:46:26 PM] nsy says: fine, my gutter will out stench your gutter any day! oh, it's on...

[5:46:52 PM] pD says: okay, we will see who makes a deeper impression

[5:47:00 PM] pD says: i have my post-it notes and pencil ready

[5:47:32 PM] nsy says: yes, i was impressed with the visuals. we will have to take photos tomorrow.

[5:48:16 PM] pD thinking this thread is degenerating quicker than expected. need to adjust the parameter. matter-of-a-factly

[5:49:12 PM] nsy says: bye :)

[5:49:22 PM] pD says: ta ta

[7:17:12 PM] AE walks by the smelly gutter people and wonder's what it's all about...

==
NSA Chatters crew

Tuesday, June 19, 2007

blog search - bubble tea - steampunk - historic perspectives - dog sex doll - Darth Vader - script

[11:16:01 AM] pD says: just an idea

[11:16:07 AM] pD says: would like to add a search function for the blog

[11:16:15 AM] pD says: did not find anything obvious inside blogger

[11:16:23 AM] pD says: is there a way to do it via google directly?

[11:16:28 AM] pD says: specify a site search or something?

[11:17:17 AM] AE says: they probably have a search tool.

[11:19:25 AM] nsy says: not sure about this one... http://userscripts.org/scripts/show/1917

[11:25:03 AM] nsy says: interesting: http://particletree.com/features/replacing-trackback-with-blog-search/
[11:33:56 AM] pD says: thanks for the two ideas, nsy

[11:34:03 AM] pD says: they both require script implementations

[11:34:14 AM] pD says: which is a bit beyond me

[11:34:23 AM] pD says: i am looking for a hosted service that is free

[11:34:29 AM] pD says: on google search

[11:34:35 AM] pD says: there is a site search ability

[11:34:51 AM] pD says: "search term site:url" is the format

[11:35:07 AM] pD says: but, when I did a "chocolate site:nsa-chatters.blogspot.com" nothing came up

[11:39:16 AM] nsy says: http://blogsearch.google.com/

[11:41:02 AM] nsy says: chocolate site:http://nsa-chatters.blogspot.com

[11:53:46 AM] pD says: http://nsa-chatters.blogspot.com/2007/06/first-responder-porn-and-vc-chocolate.html

[12:08:32 PM] pD says: nsy, thanks for figuring out

[12:08:42 PM] pD says: it does work with google blog search if specify the site

[12:08:52 PM] pD says: but, i am having problem with creating a form that would do that

[12:09:04 PM] pD says: so far, it would only pop up the goggle blog search window

[12:09:26 PM] pD says: but, it does not allow for the search entry as well as the "site:nsa-chatters.blogpot.com" append

[12:09:32 PM] pD says: can you have a look?

[12:09:38 PM] pD says:

Enter your search:


{form action="http://blogsearch.google.com" style="border:1px solid #ccc;padding:3px;text-align:center;" target="popupwindow" method="post" onsubmit="window.open('http://blogsearch.google.com', 'popupwindow', 'scrollbars=yes,width=550,height=520');return true">{br/>Enter your search:{br/>{input style="width:140px" name="search" type="text"/>{input value="+site:nsa-chatters.blogspot.com" name="site-info" type="hidden"/>{input value="Search NSA Chatters" type="submit"/>{/form>

Note: "<" has been repalced by "{" to show the code

[12:09:54 PM] pD says: i also added onto the blog, although non-functioning

[12:09:57 PM] pD says: you can refer to

[12:10:09 PM] nsy says: yah - i'm not sure about that one, there should be a way to embed the search with those default parameters - did you specify the http:// at the beginning? shouldn't make a difference.

[12:11:24 PM] AE says: wow... it's really windy and cold over here.

[12:11:25 PM] AE says: and hello

[12:11:36 PM] AE says: and the bubble tea was really interesting

[12:12:01 PM] AE says: i didn't like the way my body felt after drinking it, though. i suspect the tea has high amounts of caffeine.

[12:12:14 PM] AE says: So... Thursday is the Summer Solstice.

[12:12:21 PM] AE says: longest day of the year

[12:12:38 PM] AE says: and we're lighting a fire to warm our house today...

[12:12:54 PM] AE says: splain to me the whole global warming thing again?

[12:18:59 PM] pD sent files "[deleted]", "[deleted]", "[deleted]", "[deleted]" to members of this chat










[12:20:14 PM] pD says: glad that you enjoy bubble tea - at least the form factor

[12:20:22 PM] pD says: i know what you mean about its after effects

[12:20:50 PM] pD says: i think it is a combination of caffeine, sugar, and probably some preservatives for the color and flavors

[12:21:01 PM] pD says: i would not recommend eating it everyday

[12:21:06 PM] pD says: but, it is fun every so often

[12:21:29 PM] pD says: also gives your body some practice on foreign toxins

[12:29:20 PM] nsy says: those pictures turned out great - thanks YF!

[12:29:43 PM] AE says: yes! post them.

[12:30:02 PM] pD says: will do - post them - for this IM session

[12:45:51 PM] pD says: Steam-Driven Dreams: The Wondrously Whimsical World of Steampunk - http://www.wired.com/gadgets/mods/multimedia/2007/06/gallery_steampunk

[12:45:56 PM] pD says: this is for you, AE

[12:49:53 PM] nsy says: but i'm going to steal it from him - that stuff rocks!

[12:50:17 PM] AE says: ja, here's mine new laptop: http://gizmodo.com/photogallery/steampunkfest/2037274

[12:50:57 PM] nsy says: i've come home to Terra

[12:51:08 PM] nsy sighing whimsically

[12:51:14 PM] AE says: what is it about steampunk? am i the only one who finds this stuff interesting... Ok, nsy and I?

[12:51:50 PM] AE says: it's like the best of both worlds? the simplicity of the late victorian era combined with today's tech ideas...

[12:53:11 PM] AE says: or perhaps we're all just missing 'real' elements from our products... we touch plastic all day... we require something alive like metal and wood, leather, brass... i'm drooling...

[12:53:35 PM] nsy says: when Mike asked me what I wanted for my b-day last year, I asked for a leather motorcycle cap and goggles - one of the exhibits just reminded me of that. he could only find old welders' goggles on e-bay, but i can't see through them.

[12:54:15 PM] nsy says: http://gizmodo.com/photogallery/steampunkfest/2037266

[12:54:36 PM] AE says: http://www.wired.com/culture/design/multimedia/2007/06/gallery_nemo_office?currentPage=1&slideView=1

[12:54:58 PM] AE says: check the girlgeniousonline.com store...

[12:57:00 PM] nsy says: geez, i love this stuff! when i was a teenager, i used to horde metal scraps from the machine shops in the LA valley and use them to decorate my room, and I loved wearing old military gear, but I never knew there was a name for that stuff - much less other people doing the same thing - my peeps!

[12:57:33 PM] pD says: this is few days late, but

[12:57:35 PM] pD says: On June 16, James Joyce aficionados the world over celebrated Bloomsday.

The day is named after advertising salesman Leopold Bloom, protagonist of Joyce's novel Ulysses. The entirety of this 700+ page book recounts one ordinary day, June 16, 1904, as various characters go about their ways in Dublin.

In those 24 hours Bloom traversed the streets of Dublin.

[12:57:46 PM] pD says: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloomsday

[1:00:41 PM] AE has changed the chat topic to "SteamPunk"

[1:01:10 PM] AE says: remember the movie 20,000 leagues under the sea? I always wanted a house that looked like that set.

[1:02:35 PM] AE says: http://www.disneysub.com/index.html

[1:09:06 PM] pD the clinical contrarian

[1:09:20 PM] pD says: i enjoy steampunk stories

[1:09:35 PM] AE says: like what?

[1:09:46 PM] pD says: but, it is always the story that comes first. the use of steam as an energy source is more of a device for me

[1:09:54 PM] pD says: in otehr words, if the story stink, it ain't flying

[1:10:00 PM] AE says: but it does help set the mood.

[1:10:10 PM] pD says: well, any number of anime such as robot carnival

[1:10:20 PM] pD says: or, there was a film called steamboy by the team that made Akira

[1:10:47 PM] pD says: so, in the case of robot carnival, the story was compelling, and the steam technology, frankly, did not get in the way

[1:11:14 PM] pD says: whereas Steamboy, the story started to drag half way through and the use of steam as a technology just felt contrived

[1:11:22 PM] pD says: as for setting the mood, that is definitely true

[1:11:26 PM] pD says: on the other hand,

[1:11:45 PM] pD says: i would note that there is a good degree of "projection" in the mood

[1:12:14 PM] pD says: again, in the context of "victorian" age, there is a true sense of optimism

[1:12:31 PM] pD says: whereas futuristic stories are almost required to have

[1:12:38 PM] pD says: a sinister/sad aspect

[1:13:07 PM] pD says: just like any story, it provides a good short hand to set the mood

[1:13:27 PM] pD says: again, i am not against it, as a matter of a fact, short hands in various forms are what makes our everyday life easy

[1:14:02 PM] pD says: so, take a somewhat hybrid of steampunk and futuristic creation, Brazil

[1:14:45 PM] pD says: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0088846/

[1:15:05 PM] pD says: it has a blend of steampunk-ish technology as well as a vision of the big brother

[1:15:34 PM] pD says: let's not forget that 20th century is a very anxious time in our current intellectual perspective

[1:15:51 PM] AE says: interesting... I never would have thought of Brazil as steampunk, but the computers they used were certainly cool!

[1:16:09 PM] AE says: more like 50's era technology.

[1:16:16 PM] pD says: sure, victorian age has seen its share of bad stuff from colonization and wars

[1:16:53 PM] pD says: but, in our current historic view, these issues have been addressed, so they become more of a history as oppose to something that we are still living with today

[1:17:54 PM] pD says: when i think of Brazil, i think of george orwell which is very near victorian time but, things were starting to "downhill"

[1:18:36 PM] pD says: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_orwell

[1:24:12 PM] pD says: btw, we have some more votes for the jolly roger flag: http://www.blogpoll.com/poll/view_Results.php?poll_id=117595

[1:24:23 PM] pD says: did you guys ask your friends to vote?

[1:24:43 PM] pD says: http://nsa-chatters.blogspot.com/2007/06/vote-for-official-nsa-chatters-flag.html

[2:01:56 PM] AE says: you guys are my friends. are we supposed to have other friends as well?

[2:14:54 PM] nsy says: tablecloths were invented in the victorian era because the sight of a "leg" was considered so erotic that even table legs were covered to save men from becoming aroused and attempting lewd acts with tables. or so they said on the history channel

[2:18:19 PM] AE says: haha. and now they have dog sex dolls... ah, we've come a long ways!

[2:27:33 PM] nsy says: those poor repressed victorian women - had to go to the doctor to cure their "hysteria". As a woman, i wouldn't want to go back to those times for anything, but the retro aesthetic stuff is fun.

[2:43:54 PM] pD says: sex dolls for dogs! hahah!

[2:43:59 PM] pD says: how does that work?

[2:45:13 PM] AE says: http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/gadgets/hotdoll-the-sex-doll-for-dogs-253334.php

[2:45:30 PM] AE says: yeah.... long gone are the days of reason

[2:49:17 PM] pD says: hahah! have you read the comments?

[2:49:20 PM] pD says: it is a riot

[2:49:46 PM] pD says: is it dish washer safe? (rofl)

[2:50:07 PM] AE says: alright... with that parting gift I'm out of here.

[2:50:12 PM] AE says: see you all tomorrow.

[2:51:13 PM] pD says: wait!

[2:51:38 PM] pD says: we have not told you the brilliant darth vader, shaft flick idea!

[2:51:47 PM] AE says: ... yes?

[2:51:58 PM] pD says: ha, i thought you are leaving?

[2:52:09 PM] pD says: thought that i leave it with a cliff hanger

[2:52:21 PM] AE says: haha. Ok. Bye then!

[2:55:09 PM] pD just noticing nsy erecting rampart

[3:02:03 PM] nsy says: :)

[4:07:41 PM] pD says: so, here is the general thinking about darth vader

[4:07:51 PM] pD says: act 1 scene 1

[4:08:21 PM] pD says: vader is in S&M gear on the street - ref: the isreali ambassador

[4:09:24 PM] pD says: act 1 scene 2

[4:09:56 PM] pD says: vader is berated by his handler (Nat - as in natalie portman) for being a nincompoop

[4:10:45 PM] pD says: we a transformation in vader as Nat tells him that he is just a good-for-nothing into "shaft" he is out to do good and stand by the weak

[4:11:16 PM] pD says: act 2 scene 1

[4:12:37 PM] pD says: vader is on the prowl. he is picking up trash on the street, walking (and scaring) little kids cross the street, then, he hear panting (scream-ish) noises from a shop/shack

[4:12:46 PM] pD says: act 2 scene 2

[4:14:04 PM] pD says: vader finds a small man lamenting his inability to provide good massage service due to overwork and poor nutrition. then, comes a lady in robe asking what is the hold up. she ain't got whole day for her session.

[4:16:03 PM] pD says: we see a spark in vader's eye/mask while the voice over says "i must save this man from his misery". then, vader turned to the lady and politely ask her to wait a few minutes as the small man "Bakka-san" is just about ready for a new regime specially designed for her. The lady leaves in delight with a worried look in Bakka-san's face

[4:16:08 PM] pD says: act 3 scene 1

[4:17:16 PM] pD says: the lady is stretched out on the massage table, you can see her happy face and complimenting how Bakka's regime is amazing, but there is nobody in the room.

[4:18:31 PM] pD says: but to the other side of the wall, we see vader giving air massage while there is an air of quiet happiness on the face of Bakka-san

[4:19:38 PM] pD says: then, suddenly vader's cell phone rang. Bakka-san gestured to vader to continue and pick up the cell phone and talk into it. inaudible but you hear Nat's giggle and Bakka-san's face brighten and impressed as the conversation continues

[4:19:45 PM] pD says: act 3 scene 2

[4:20:38 PM] pD says: the finale: the shop/shack now looks busy with a long line of women talking excitedly about this new massage regime that hits the spot.

[4:20:50 PM] pD says: cut to the massage table, a happy woman

[4:21:10 PM] pD says: cut to vader room, vader is giving air massage with sweat on the mask

[4:21:43 PM] pD says: cut to another room and Bakka-san and Nat are happily counting the money

[4:21:45 PM] pD says: the end


==
NSA Chatters Crew

first responder - Porn and VC - chocolate - bubble tea - pastry - vegetarian - NPR

[10:52:38 AM] pD says: howdy!

[10:53:04 AM] pD says: hope everyone had a good weekend

[10:53:08 AM] pD says: mine was quite decent

[10:53:14 AM] pD says: sorry for being grumpy earlier with AE

[10:54:07 AM] nsy says: it's been crazy lately - something in the air. i have an install at 11, so talk to you later :)

[10:54:16 AM] pD says: i am usually full of thoughts (all varieties) in the morning

[10:54:30 AM] pD says: just takes a bit o time to sort them through - or suppress them

[10:58:51 AM] pD says: as for that air thing

[10:59:00 AM] pD says: i think it is call the end of quarter madness

[11:08:42 AM] pD says: speaking of which, I assume the same applies to spammers, got about double the usual amount of spam - this is with the spam filter turned on...

[11:17:41 AM] AE says: want to hear about my last 24 hours?

[11:17:50 AM] pD says: shoot

[11:17:56 AM] AE says: I helped some friends set up for their wedding.

[11:18:01 AM] AE says: then officiated the wedding.

[11:18:17 AM] AE says: That was way fun. Reverend AE. heh

[11:18:37 AM] AE says: Then, this morning on the way to work, I was first on the scene of a car flipped over on Bear Creek road.

[11:19:03 AM] AE says: The driver was just trying to get out of his car when I got there. He asked if I could help him turn his car over so he could get to work.

[11:19:20 AM] AE says: The top of the vehicle was caved in, and he was bleeding from a head wound.

[11:19:40 AM] AE says: So, I asked him what his name was. He stood there for a moment and couldn't remember.

[11:19:52 AM] AE says: So I asked him to sit down on the side of the road.

[11:20:17 AM] AE says: At this point, as I was starting to tend to his head wound there were screeching tires.

[11:20:30 AM] AE says: His car was blocking both lanes, and we were on a blind corner.

[11:21:02 AM] AE says: I got my two ancient flares and handed them to some of the other drivers that had stopped so they could help prevent another accident.

[11:21:22 AM] AE says: When I turned back, the guy with the head wound was trying to push his car out of the way.

[11:21:47 AM] AE says: So I sat him back down and started working on him again. Then I noticed there was a bush on fire just up the road.

[11:22:03 AM] AE says: One of the road flares had rolled into the brush on the side and started a fire.

[11:22:37 AM] AE says: So, I ran off with my fire extinguisher and put it out. In the mean time, the injured driver was up again, trying to convince other people that he was fine and needed to get to work.

[11:23:16 AM] AE says: At that point another person came running up and introduced himself as a first responder. He had a first aid kit, so I set him to babysitting the injured driver.

[11:23:39 AM] AE says: Then I helped rotate the flipped car so it was only blocking one lane and we started directing traffic.

[11:24:02 AM] AE says: About 30 minutes later, the CHP arrived and we handed everything over to them.

[11:24:08 AM] AE says: Observations:

[11:24:25 AM] AE says: 1. The driver couldn't remember his name, but knew he had to get to work.

[11:25:00 AM] AE says: 2. Some people stopped to help, some people just watched, and some people got angry that we were interrupting their commute.

[11:25:26 AM] AE says: 3. Of the 4 people who stopped to help, ALL had first responder training.

[11:25:57 AM] AE says: i don't know if that's just the kind of people who go for that class, or if it's something about the training.

[11:26:12 AM] AE says: so. how was your morning?

[11:26:26 AM] AE says: actually, I'm off to get food. I have an install soon.

[11:26:56 AM] pD says: going a conference call, BRB

[12:02:09 PM] AE says: when were you grumpy?

[12:02:20 PM] AE says: you've never been grumpy with me.

[12:11:34 PM] pD says: thank you for sharing your first responder story

[12:11:48 PM] pD says: it is fascinating from your perspective

[12:12:20 PM] pD says: I think you are absolutely right that it is a self-selecting group of people who would be a first responder

[12:13:16 PM] pD says: i wonder if this happened on the silicon valley stretch of 101, how many first responders would we get

[12:13:45 PM] pD says: as for people responding differently with the accident, that is, (un)fortunately, human nature

[12:14:05 PM] pD says: i think it may be helpful for first responders to get a vest that would help people understand the situation

[12:22:01 PM] AE says: good point about the location.

[12:22:26 PM] AE says: since it's on a stretch of road that was impassible, there were several of us who had no choice.

[12:22:39 PM] AE says: in fact, the only times I've stopped to assist have been on mountain roads.

[12:23:19 PM] AE says: when I see a vehicle on the side of the freeway, I tend to check to see if 1. Anyone is laying near the car, 2. the hood is up, 3. Anyone is jumping around frantically while bleeding.

[12:23:33 PM] AE says: if none of those conditions are met, I drive by without even looking.

[12:23:50 PM] AE says: and the hood up isn't as certain for me as it used to be.

[1:05:16 PM] pD says: nsy, recall the discussion about how porn drives technology

[1:05:31 PM] pD says: A collection of recordings from the 1890s are now on CD. But be warned: They're a bit off-color. In fact, Actionable Offenses: Indecent Phonograph Recordings from the 1890s are shock-jock worthy.

[1:05:37 PM] pD says: http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=11131880&sc=emaf

[1:05:56 PM] pD says: they also drove the development of wax sound recordings.

[1:06:37 PM] AE says: I think it's more the gaming industry that's got it now.

[1:06:52 PM] AE says: they certainly drive computer upgrades in our house!

[1:07:14 PM] AE says: but you're correct; the pr0n industry made the internet what it is today.

[1:07:20 PM] AE says: spam included.

[1:07:31 PM] pD says: you know, i think there is a lesson there somewhere

[1:08:10 PM] pD says: if i were a VC, i would use a "Porn-o-Meter" to gauge how evasice a new "disruptive" technology is

[1:08:22 PM] pD says: if it can be easily adopted by porn people, we have got a winner

[1:08:29 PM] pD says: the rest are just incremental improvements

[1:10:09 PM] AE says: "evasice"?

[1:12:43 PM] pD says: pervasive

[1:12:47 PM] pD says: :)!

[1:12:58 PM] pD says: i think better than i can type

[1:13:11 PM] pD says: btw, what is everyone's schedule for the afternoon?

[1:13:27 PM] pD says: may want to propose a field trip if the schedules align

[1:13:32 PM] AE says: i'm out of here at 3PM, and, in theory have an install call.

[1:13:39 PM] AE says: oh. where? Cheese factory?

[1:14:03 PM] pD says: when is the install call?

[1:14:14 PM] AE says: now... but they're not there.

[1:14:27 PM] pD says: nsy?

[1:14:32 PM] AE says: I'm going to try them in a few minutes. If they don't pick up I'll send an email to reschedule

[1:14:42 PM] AE says: nsy has to eat food or she will fall over onto her keyboard and inadvertently programming an AI that will take over the world.

[1:14:56 PM] AE says: *program

[1:15:22 PM] pD says: nsy needs to lose weight. she can go without food

[1:15:37 PM] pD btw, we all know nsy is too thin...

[1:15:59 PM] pD says: let's wait for nsy to get her lunch. i have a 1:30 call anyway

[1:18:00 PM] AE says: Ok. but where is the field trip? Do we get to learn where wheat comes from?

[1:58:28 PM] AE says: or where chocolate is made!

[1:58:32 PM] AE says: let's go there!

[2:15:37 PM] nsy says: woo hoo! my AI program was almost loosed upon the world, but it was averted at the last moment by the flying buddha's tasty treats - whew!

[2:15:49 PM] nsy says: PS: I'm not fat, I'm big boned. ;)

[2:16:20 PM] nsy says: so where is the field trip taking us? adventure, science, and sweets? oh boy!

[2:18:04 PM] pD says: and, i am not a fat head, just wide temple'd

[2:18:52 PM] AE says: if nsy were thinner, she'd be transparent.

[2:19:17 PM] pD says: i can hardly see her as it is

[2:19:55 PM] AE says: a lot of people seem to over look her...

[2:20:14 PM] AE says: which is strange, because she's really not someone you want to miss!

[2:20:31 PM] AE says: and now she's going to blush and unleash her AI on me.

[2:22:06 PM] pD says: i think she more of the pitch fork type

[2:22:20 PM] AE says: what?

[2:22:25 PM] AE says: what does that mean?

[2:22:42 PM] AE says: is this some quaint farming reference from your home country of Kansas?

[2:23:14 PM] nsy says: mwahahahah ...

[2:23:41 PM] nsy says: i think he's calling me delightfully devilish

[2:24:06 PM] nsy says: yes, you have to watch out for those transparent ones

[2:24:43 PM] nsy says: hey, wait, does that mean i'm a poultryghost (sp?)?

[2:25:04 PM] pD says: pls refer to the image in the middle section of this entry: http://nsa-chatters.blogspot.com/2007/06/judges-poetry-tennyson-philosophers.html

[2:25:11 PM] pD says: ref: delightfully devilish

[2:25:26 PM] AE says: poultryghost?

[2:25:35 PM] AE says: what's with the farming references today?

[2:25:37 PM] pD says: pastry ghost?

[2:25:47 PM] AE says: mmm... doughnuts....

[2:26:05 PM] pD says: pantry ghost?

[2:26:13 PM] nsy says: mmm, that’s much better... pastry... mmm.

[2:26:20 PM] nsy says: ok, not one step further!

[2:26:44 PM] nsy says: we all know what's next

[2:26:51 PM] AE says: pasty ghost

[2:27:05 PM] pD says: i like chocolate paste

[2:27:11 PM] pD says: if it is made with good chocolate, that is

[2:27:19 PM] AE says: i just don't worry about broken chocolate bars.

[2:27:27 PM] AE says: then you never need to paste them.

[2:27:31 PM] pD says: hmm... i think a few pastry images would do well right now

[2:27:33 PM] pD says: nsy?

[2:28:19 PM] pD says: never knew nsy looks so good with a mustache: http://www.gardenmob.com/snidely-whiplash.jpg

[2:28:26 PM] nsy says: hm, i was hoping for a poultryghost, but came up with a weird story... http://lists.asu.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0009&L=histarch&T=0&P=4521

[2:32:35 PM] pD says: oh, right

[2:32:48 PM] pD says: i was thinking that since we have a full quorum, we should try to get bubble tea

[2:39:58 PM] nsy says: ooh - bubble tea!

[2:40:27 PM] nsy says: i love my moustache!

[2:41:01 PM] pD says: patsy ghost?

[2:41:22 PM] nsy says: http://www.cakesbycremedelacreme.com/images/pastry.jpg

[2:41:54 PM] nsy says: http://www.wtv-zone.com/homeaway/CW/patsymontana.jpg

[2:42:04 PM] pD says: btw, what is a poultryghost?

[2:42:21 PM] AE says: and what's bubble tea?

[2:42:49 PM] nsy says: oops - wrong patsy http://www.bookitentertainment.com/images/large_photos/patsy_cline.jpg

[2:43:10 PM] AE says: poultry ghost sounds like why I became a vegetarian.

[2:43:35 PM] pD says: speaking of pastry, i love pierre herme: http://gc-gastronomic.blogspot.com/2004/12/pierre-herm.html

[2:43:40 PM] AE says: I was sitting there, alone at home in January, 1993 and got really hungry.

[2:44:01 PM] AE says: Then Suddenly I had this great idea of getting a big huge bucket o greasy chicken parts.

[2:44:07 PM] AE says: So I did.

[2:44:12 PM] AE says: and I ate the whole bucket.

[2:44:19 PM] AE says: and I've never been sicker in my life.

[2:44:39 PM] AE says: after that, meat just didn't look good to me anymore.

[2:44:41 PM] AE says: more

[2:45:48 PM] pD says: i am sorry AE

[2:46:00 PM] pD says: this has to do with your "desire" as oppose to any reflection on chicken

[2:46:16 PM] pD says: don't pin it on the poultry, just ain't fair

[2:46:18 PM] AE says: nope. it was the chicken.

[2:46:23 PM] nsy says: hmmm. is that like the concept of smoking a carton of cigarettes until you get sick so you never want another one?

[2:46:39 PM] AE says: yuck. does that work?

[2:46:44 PM] pD says: the same logic can extend to anything

[2:46:55 PM] pD says: eat a whole bucket of tofu until you are sick!

[2:47:00 PM] pD says: it ain't the tofu

[2:47:02 PM] AE says: extend it to wealth, then.

[2:47:05 PM] pD says: it is you

[2:47:14 PM] pD says: that is fair, i have not gotten sick yet

[2:47:27 PM] pD says: (rofl) i am so smart!

[2:48:03 PM] pD says: btw, are we doing bubble tea?

[2:48:07 PM] AE says: rotflol

[2:48:30 PM] AE says: what is bubble tea?

[2:48:45 PM] nsy says: mmmmm herme... that chocolate looks decadent!

[2:48:53 PM] nsy says: i'm up for bubble tea

[2:49:57 PM] pD says: tapioca tea snack: middle section: http://nsa-chatters.blogspot.com/2007/05/foods-around-world-kublacon-and-games.html

[2:50:21 PM] pD says: herme kicks ass when it comes to presentation of pastry

[2:50:34 PM] pD says: its chocolate is not bad, but the pastry is quite excellent

[2:52:12 PM] pD says: another really good pastry Shop is Christian Constant: http://gc-gastronomic.blogspot.com/2004/12/christian-constant.html

[2:52:27 PM] pD says: they make a pear custer pastry that was just amazing

[2:53:55 PM] nsy says: mmmm

[2:54:25 PM] pD says: closer to home, there is an excellent pastry shop in los altos

[2:54:33 PM] pD says: maybe we can plan to go there one of these days

[2:54:40 PM] nsy says: although, i'm not big on custards, puddings, flan, etc

[2:55:06 PM] nsy says: yes, i'd love that! i love sweets!

[2:56:40 PM] pD says: Satura cakes: http://www.saturacakes.com/store/

[2:57:52 PM] nsy says: you're killin' me! That looks scrumptious!

[2:58:25 PM] pD says: unlike certain chicken hater (a-hem)

[2:58:39 PM] pD says: i believe in consume copious quantity of stuff that i like

[2:58:48 PM] pD says: just not all at once

[3:19:10 PM] pD says: AE, are you heading out?

[3:19:13 PM] nsy says: regulated hedonism? is that an oxymoron?

[3:19:43 PM] AE says: yes. and yes.

[3:20:51 PM] AE says: bye

[3:22:53 PM] pD says: should we get bubble tea on the way out?

[3:23:07 PM] pD says: nsy and i will come back via the carpool lane!

[3:23:29 PM] pD says: moderation is the key

[3:24:09 PM] pD says: for example, if you murder people with wider time interval, you will be classified as a serial much later

[3:24:20 PM] pD ever the insightful one

[4:49:29 PM] nsy says: i'm going to see the police in LA this weekend, so after that last comment, I now have their song in my head "murder by numbers... 1, 2, 3... its as easy to learn as your ABCs"...

[4:50:23 PM] pD says: the sugar high of bubble tea doing its magic

[4:50:25 PM] pD says: yes!

[4:50:33 PM] nsy says: woo hoo!

[4:52:00 PM] nsy says: I still haven't has time to check out the lewd old radio stuff from NPR. it sounds like there's some joke video going around the office along the same lines

[5:04:02 PM] pD says: i must confess that i do not get the old recording - but i am sure it was in extremely poor taste back then

[5:04:09 PM] pD saying with a glint in his eye

[5:27:03 PM] nsy says: well, my carpool i on his way - so i'll talk to you again tomorrow! bye :)

[5:31:01 PM] pD says: okay

[5:31:09 PM] pD says: thanks for the bubble tea

[5:31:23 PM] pD says: we should plan a few field trips that we would take up every few weeks